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Game Master's Laboratory

Public β€’ 121 β€’ Free

6 contributions to Game Master's Laboratory
Make the BBEG the Side Quest
When commenting on @Jesse Livingston 's Post I had a Jimmy Newton style brain blast about this graphic. I'm not a graphic designer so I am not sure if it gets my point across, but I think I unlocked why I like this style of gming so much. I think there is the explicit idea of making sure that the story is developed by the players as much as the GM, but I think another implicit or perfect accident is making sure that the story is created by each of the players, not just the loudest in the room (speaking as the loudest in the room in most cases). It is really easy in the traditional model to fall into the trappings that the players can only propose side quests that are just set dressing. In this side quest mentality, eventually you have to address the "real problem" and often a player gets cut off during their arc, or even before. I am running a Buffy the Vampire Slayer game right now, and I think I am going to be very intentionally making the main plot a source of obstacles of their goals, rather than the core driving force. With a player that wants to have his character romance another character (its cute because they are married, he wants to them to fall in love all over again), and two others who are dealing with the hole left if their lives by their missing mothers (one of whom inherited her families werewolf powers and the other who is dealing with being the slayer), I feel like I've got some good (heart) Strings to pull on.
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New comment 26d ago
Make the BBEG the Side Quest
2 likes β€’ 28d
You make a really great point about side quests. That's something I've felt in a campaign I've been in for about 4 years now. The GM is open to us proposing side quests, but "his story" is always the center of it. This post helped me identify that element of this that I hadn't considered before! He had a *very* hard time believing that his game wasn't player proactive. And this was one of his arguments, that players sometimes propose these side quests and he'll accommodate that. But to your point, that's another symptom of reactive playstyles.
When players are proactive but good is still reactive
Isn't it interesting that you can have a proactive player goal where "good" is still reactive? Take the following player goal from the book as an example (the book is excellent BTW so this is not a criticism at all): - "I want to free my hometown from the rule of the orc clans." This goal is: Player = Proactive Good = Reactive See that? The orcs did something bad and good is reacting to it, even though the player is the proactive one here. Or take this example: - "I want to break the curse plaguing my family line." This is also, player = proactive, good = reactive. The curse (evil) made the first move and the player is reacting to that. So, there are actually two layers of proactivity here. There is the player / GM layer, and then there is the good / evil layer. I bring this up not to say that this is a problem necessarily. The players came up with these goals, they are driving the plot forward (which is the center of proactive play). It's just to point this out: Proactive Good is sometimes rare and can be challenging to envision even in a proactive game. It made me curious to make a list of all some goals a player might have where good is actually proactively like: - Obtaining a magical artifact - Mentoring someone - Establishing a new city - Seeking out a lost person - Winning a love interest - Building a structure of some kind Perhaps it's just a philosophical consideration, but I think the thrust of the argument in the beginning of the book is a strong one. It begs is to ask the question: How can we have stories where good is truly proactive?
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New comment 27d ago
3 likes β€’ 28d
@Briggs Schneider absolutely. I think the core of proactive play is exactly what you said: The player creates the goal that they pursue vs. the GM creating it. I don't think a player righting a wrong is "reactive" in the sense we are talking about here. It was just an interesting realization for me to see this duality within each goal, that player proactivity doesn't always = good proactivity. Again, not a problem, just interesting from a philosophical perspective. It makes me wonder: would heroes get endlessly bored in a world without evil? if so, do they *need* to keep evil around to be heroes at all? πŸ€”
Question about Goals.
Hola Masters! I’m still working on the very first proactive campaign and I have a question maybe you can all help me? When a player sets a goal, let’s say a short one. And the step/steps he is going to take to complete it, is it always right? Example: My players sets the goal of killing the Kobold King, asking around he is told by an NPC that it is hidden in this cavern. May the NPC been lying? Is it better that the players fulfill their goals using exactly the steps they came up with to do so? All advice will be appreciated! Gracias!
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New comment 27d ago
3 likes β€’ 29d
I'm very new to proactive role-playing, but I think @Jay Robinson hit the nail on the head: Your players don't write the plot. In fact, I'd say no one should be writing a plot because that's not how TTRPG ultimately works. But I digress... When your player writes a goal, they are writing the steps *they think* will get them to the goal not *the actual steps that will result in the goal being completed*. They might ask the NPC where the Kobold king is because they think that's a reasonable next step, not because you both have decided that's going to work. Whether that's going to work is combination of dozens of variables that play out at the table. And to @Briggs Schneider 's point, it shouldn't work exactly the way they plan. They need resistance to their goals to make it a challenge.
2 likes β€’ 29d
@Tristan Fishel thank you! Agreed 100%. I remember a Pixar director who worked on Finding Nemo said something like, "The audience wants to work for their lunch." Not the same medium as we have no audience, but even in a passive setting, the audience doesn't want it to be easy. On the plot side, this reminds me of the "don't prep plots" article in the Alexandrian (I've linked it before). This is was the spark that brought me to this community. @Alberto Ortiz, I would highly recommend this article: https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/4147/roleplaying-games/dont-prep-plots I'm reminded of a quote from Will Wright (creator of the SIMs). He said something like, "I'm giving the player a toy and the player is turning it into a game." The way I think of it, we create the world (the "toy"), either by ourselves or with the players. Then the players turn that "toy" into a story by their choices at the table. That's where the magic and the challenge comes in.
Greetings
Greetings gamers! I just joined this community after seeing the YouTube video from GinnyD. I've been very drawn to the idea of proactive role playing ever since I read this article, "Don't Prep Plots": https://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/4147/roleplaying-games/dont-prep-plots I've been intrigued by the idea that D&D isn't a story. It's a toy that we hand our players. I myself am always more engaged when I'm playing and driving things rather than being told a story. Glad to have found this community and these resources. Cheers!
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New comment Oct 21
1 like β€’ Oct 19
@Briggs Schneider thanks for the welcome!
0 likes β€’ Oct 19
@Tristan Fishel thanks!
Teamwork + Proactive Role Playing?
I'd like to know how you all get players to work together in a proactive model. Here's something I've noticed: The more proactive I am as a player the more independent I become. My character wants to do something that doesn't necessarily align with what the other players want to do. In a reactive model, they all work together because they aren't thinking about what they want anyway. The DM gives them an objective, and they all do it. So how does this work in a proactive model?
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New comment Oct 21
1 like β€’ Oct 19
Ooo the clashing over conflicting goals! Hadn't thought of that.
1-6 of 6
Jesse Livingston
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38points to level up
@jesse-livingston-7541
Been playing D&D for about 6 years and dming for about 2 to 3. I love the idea of proactive role-playing!

Active 8d ago
Joined Oct 19, 2024
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